E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by smellycat801 »

priestess wrote:I would say the overreacting and Ellie's reaction to what is going on is a reflection of her culture. It's not just for viewers she doesn't know; it's for people who may be watching in her ward.

I've been super fascinated with Utah Mormon culture mainly because I disagree with so many things. LGBTQIA policies, the fact that women are expected to be stay at home moms & the highest thing they can do is be president of their local relief society charity, that being black is considered a curse from god. It's like Scientology too where they don't associate with ex-mormons, and they have such strange "secretive" rituals in the temple. Plus those god awful temple garmets we can occasionally see the Griffith sibs wear under their clothes. The goal is to be the happiest, Whitest family with no problems in the least. You're raised from birth to be a perfect mormon barbie doll, and if you can't keep it up then you're out of your temple wedding. In the mormon community, women are expected to have at least 5 kids. They actually look down at you if you have anything less; I was reading on one ex mormon forum where they were giving one mom hell until she broke down in a meeting about her struggles with getting pregnant again. One mother had three kids, and someone else was like "well of COURSE you have a job, you only have three children!!"

So, in a culture where the value of a woman is equated to their ability of how well they 1) birth some babies, 2) clean up after everyone, and 3) have a pinterest-perfect house, of course she's devastated. I think they're also trying to drum it up with shots like Jared sitting in the bathroom so that way their ward knows they're trying, it's not their fault, and it's not intentional. I didn't see the phone call so I don't know if she's intentionally insensitive and bitchy, but for the most part it seems like she's really wrapped up in her own life & trying to project that image of perfection to everyone that she decided to do that.

ALSO I'm not trying to knock SAHM & SAHD's or anything! It's a super hard job & is important. I just find it really strange that women expect & are expected to stay at home while the father works, especially in this day in age where it's so expensive.
I'm a Utah Ex-Mormon, and it isn't true that Mormons aren't supposed to associate with ex-Mormon. Yes, there are assholes who choose that on their own, but it isn't what the church actually teaches or encourages.

Also, I never heard that they should have at least 5 kids. Big families are common and in a way encouraged, but there isn't any sort of teaching or rule on the number of children you should have.

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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by priestess »

smellycat801 wrote:
priestess wrote:I would say the overreacting and Ellie's reaction to what is going on is a reflection of her culture. It's not just for viewers she doesn't know; it's for people who may be watching in her ward.

I've been super fascinated with Utah Mormon culture mainly because I disagree with so many things. LGBTQIA policies, the fact that women are expected to be stay at home moms & the highest thing they can do is be president of their local relief society charity, that being black is considered a curse from god. It's like Scientology too where they don't associate with ex-mormons, and they have such strange "secretive" rituals in the temple. Plus those god awful temple garmets we can occasionally see the Griffith sibs wear under their clothes. The goal is to be the happiest, Whitest family with no problems in the least. You're raised from birth to be a perfect mormon barbie doll, and if you can't keep it up then you're out of your temple wedding. In the mormon community, women are expected to have at least 5 kids. They actually look down at you if you have anything less; I was reading on one ex mormon forum where they were giving one mom hell until she broke down in a meeting about her struggles with getting pregnant again. One mother had three kids, and someone else was like "well of COURSE you have a job, you only have three children!!"

So, in a culture where the value of a woman is equated to their ability of how well they 1) birth some babies, 2) clean up after everyone, and 3) have a pinterest-perfect house, of course she's devastated. I think they're also trying to drum it up with shots like Jared sitting in the bathroom so that way their ward knows they're trying, it's not their fault, and it's not intentional. I didn't see the phone call so I don't know if she's intentionally insensitive and bitchy, but for the most part it seems like she's really wrapped up in her own life & trying to project that image of perfection to everyone that she decided to do that.

ALSO I'm not trying to knock SAHM & SAHD's or anything! It's a super hard job & is important. I just find it really strange that women expect & are expected to stay at home while the father works, especially in this day in age where it's so expensive.
I'm a Utah Ex-Mormon, and it isn't true that Mormons aren't supposed to associate with ex-Mormon. Yes, there are assholes who choose that on their own, but it isn't what the church actually teaches or encourages.

Also, I never heard that they should have at least 5 kids. Big families are common and in a way encouraged, but there isn't any sort of teaching or rule on the number of children you should have.

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That's interesting! But yeah, it's not explicitly written however there are those who choose to excommunicate from those who were excommunicated/chose to left. Did you find it was more older people who felt like they had to stop talking to ex-mos and younger people who were more accepting?
It's probably different for each person. Threads mention the 5 is the magic number for having kids unwritten rule due to the whole "multiply and replenish the earth" thing. Could be different for each person.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by smellycat801 »

priestess wrote:
smellycat801 wrote:
priestess wrote:I would say the overreacting and Ellie's reaction to what is going on is a reflection of her culture. It's not just for viewers she doesn't know; it's for people who may be watching in her ward.

I've been super fascinated with Utah Mormon culture mainly because I disagree with so many things. LGBTQIA policies, the fact that women are expected to be stay at home moms & the highest thing they can do is be president of their local relief society charity, that being black is considered a curse from god. It's like Scientology too where they don't associate with ex-mormons, and they have such strange "secretive" rituals in the temple. Plus those god awful temple garmets we can occasionally see the Griffith sibs wear under their clothes. The goal is to be the happiest, Whitest family with no problems in the least. You're raised from birth to be a perfect mormon barbie doll, and if you can't keep it up then you're out of your temple wedding. In the mormon community, women are expected to have at least 5 kids. They actually look down at you if you have anything less; I was reading on one ex mormon forum where they were giving one mom hell until she broke down in a meeting about her struggles with getting pregnant again. One mother had three kids, and someone else was like "well of COURSE you have a job, you only have three children!!"

So, in a culture where the value of a woman is equated to their ability of how well they 1) birth some babies, 2) clean up after everyone, and 3) have a pinterest-perfect house, of course she's devastated. I think they're also trying to drum it up with shots like Jared sitting in the bathroom so that way their ward knows they're trying, it's not their fault, and it's not intentional. I didn't see the phone call so I don't know if she's intentionally insensitive and bitchy, but for the most part it seems like she's really wrapped up in her own life & trying to project that image of perfection to everyone that she decided to do that.

ALSO I'm not trying to knock SAHM & SAHD's or anything! It's a super hard job & is important. I just find it really strange that women expect & are expected to stay at home while the father works, especially in this day in age where it's so expensive.
I'm a Utah Ex-Mormon, and it isn't true that Mormons aren't supposed to associate with ex-Mormon. Yes, there are assholes who choose that on their own, but it isn't what the church actually teaches or encourages.

Also, I never heard that they should have at least 5 kids. Big families are common and in a way encouraged, but there isn't any sort of teaching or rule on the number of children you should have.

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That's interesting! But yeah, it's not explicitly written however there are those who choose to excommunicate from those who were excommunicated/chose to left. Did you find it was more older people who felt like they had to stop talking to ex-mos and younger people who were more accepting?
It's probably different for each person. Threads mention the 5 is the magic number for having kids unwritten rule due to the whole "multiply and replenish the earth" thing. Could be different for each person.
I think it just depends on the person. My family is still super Mormon (Dad is currently a Bishop) but they've all been really good to me since I left the Church.

I could definitely see Ellie not being so nice to Ex Mormons, but then Jared strikes me as someone who would still treat them well.

I think another factor is the area you live in. I live in an area that isn't super concentrated with Mormons, so people are just used to any of the neighbors not being Mormon and it isn't a big deal. But go to one of the higher concentrated areas, and there are going to be some people who are jerks because ex-Mormons are going to be the "different" ones.

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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

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5 min video today, Jared said they are preparing for a D&C tomorrow


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E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

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gymchick43 wrote:5 min video today, Jared said they are preparing for a D&C tomorrow


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That's interesting, and tells me that Ellie isn't doing well emotionally (which I totally understand). She said a few days ago the plan was to stop the Progesterone and wait a week or two. Then the next day they have Misoprostal and are supposedly miscarrying, and then a D&C tomorrow. That's a lot more intervention in a short period of time than doctors usually like to do. Most patient women are desperate to get it over with, so I imagine Ellie is probably not doing that great. She may also not want to wait two weeks longer to start trying again. I remember that feeling all too well also.

Most people have to take time off work to deal with things like this, it really doesn't sit well with me that they are profiting off this. Jared had to put a vlog out I suppose, but I think he should just take a few days break.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by menehune »

HelloSweetie wrote:
gymchick43 wrote:5 min video today, Jared said they are preparing for a D&C tomorrow


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That's interesting, and tells me that Ellie isn't doing well emotionally (which I totally understand). She said a few days ago the plan was to stop the Progesterone and wait a week or two. Then the next day they have Misoprostal and are supposedly miscarrying, and then a D&C tomorrow. That's a lot more intervention in a short period of time than doctors usually like to do. Most patient women are desperate to get it over with, so I imagine Ellie is probably not doing that great. She may also not want to wait two weeks longer to start trying again. I remember that feeling all too well also.

Most people have to take time off work to deal with things like this, it really doesn't sit well with me that they are profiting off this. Jared had to put a vlog out I suppose, but I think he should just take a few days break.
I thought the same thing. A lot has gone on in a short period of time and from any care I've received this is atypical. Waiting for the Progesterone to wear off may be miserable, but a natural miscarriage is gentler on your body and has far fewer risks. I doubt Ellie has done her research and knows that though.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by BadWolf »

Ellie's parents are currently enjoying a lavish European vacation. They are posting pics and vids on instagram daily. Do we think Ellie is bothered by the fact that mother hasn't rushed home to be at her side?

Maybe the excess dramatics aren't just for the vlog? Maybe they are to make Jennifer feel guilty for not being home with her baby?
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by lyddiebug »

I haven't been watching Ellie+Jared for awhile, because I generally think their videos are boring and full of enthusiasm for literally the most boring things. But, I saw the title for their miscarriage video and have watched all the videos since then. I absolutely ache for Ellie and Jared and the grieving process they are going through (not to mention Jackson, who was excited about a little brother or sister, and who probably doesn't fully understand what is happening). However, it really upsets me when they talk about how "tender" Jackson and Calvin are being to Ellie. Jackson and Calvin are toddlers. Of course, I think that they should be good to Ellie and treat her well during her grieving process, but constantly talking about how sweet they are being makes it sound like it is the job of these small children to take care of their parents. Also, Jackson probably needs some support from his parents at this juncture too; of course, they won't realize this, because they continue to treat Jackson as an infant who cannot do or understand anything.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by gopedjane »

BadWolf wrote:Ellie's parents are currently enjoying a lavish European vacation. They are posting pics and vids on instagram daily. Do we think Ellie is bothered by the fact that mother hasn't rushed home to be at her side?

Maybe the excess dramatics aren't just for the vlog? Maybe they are to make Jennifer feel guilty for not being home with her baby?
Yeah, but who as an adult would want their mother to come home from a vacation to come and comfort them for a miscarriage. Not saying that it's not a big deal but most people don't even tell people until they are out of the first trimester, so many just go through it alone. As much as she wants attention, I can't fathom that she would need her mother to ruin her vacation to come home and comfort her.

I was feeling bad for them and still do but the vlog yesterday and today are a bit much for me. Like they are capitalizing on it and if they don't have anything else to vlog about, then take a break. They've basically tagged these videos to continuously bring in more income.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

gopedjane wrote:
BadWolf wrote:Ellie's parents are currently enjoying a lavish European vacation. They are posting pics and vids on instagram daily. Do we think Ellie is bothered by the fact that mother hasn't rushed home to be at her side?

Maybe the excess dramatics aren't just for the vlog? Maybe they are to make Jennifer feel guilty for not being home with her baby?
Yeah, but who as an adult would want their mother to come home from a vacation to come and comfort them for a miscarriage. Not saying that it's not a big deal but most people don't even tell people until they are out of the first trimester, so many just go through it alone. As much as she wants attention, I can't fathom that she would need her mother to ruin her vacation to come home and comfort her.

I was feeling bad for them and still do but the vlog yesterday and today are a bit much for me. Like they are capitalizing on it and if they don't have anything else to vlog about, then take a break. They've basically tagged these videos to continuously bring in more income.
A Narcissist would.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by Pency »

lyddiebug wrote:I haven't been watching Ellie+Jared for awhile, because I generally think their videos are boring and full of enthusiasm for literally the most boring things. But, I saw the title for their miscarriage video and have watched all the videos since then. I absolutely ache for Ellie and Jared and the grieving process they are going through (not to mention Jackson, who was excited about a little brother or sister, and who probably doesn't fully understand what is happening). However, it really upsets me when they talk about how "tender" Jackson and Calvin are being to Ellie. Jackson and Calvin are toddlers. Of course, I think that they should be good to Ellie and treat her well during her grieving process, but constantly talking about how sweet they are being makes it sound like it is the job of these small children to take care of their parents. Also, Jackson probably needs some support from his parents at this juncture too; of course, they won't realize this, because they continue to treat Jackson as an infant who cannot do or understand anything.
Yeah, it really bugs me. I don't know if I agree that they treat Jackson like an infant, I feel like in lots of ways they expect him to take on very adult roles, telling him about every pregnancy, how pregnancy tests work, taking him and Cal to a viability scan -- it's just too much, and what you said about them expecting the boys to take on a nurturing role is so true. It's not your toddler's job to nuture you, it's the other way around. It can be a psychologically damaging thing for a child to feel like they have to take care of their parents instead of the other way around.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by gopedjane »

lyddiebug wrote:I haven't been watching Ellie+Jared for awhile, because I generally think their videos are boring and full of enthusiasm for literally the most boring things. But, I saw the title for their miscarriage video and have watched all the videos since then. I absolutely ache for Ellie and Jared and the grieving process they are going through (not to mention Jackson, who was excited about a little brother or sister, and who probably doesn't fully understand what is happening). However, it really upsets me when they talk about how "tender" Jackson and Calvin are being to Ellie. Jackson and Calvin are toddlers. Of course, I think that they should be good to Ellie and treat her well during her grieving process, but constantly talking about how sweet they are being makes it sound like it is the job of these small children to take care of their parents. Also, Jackson probably needs some support from his parents at this juncture too; of course, they won't realize this, because they continue to treat Jackson as an infant who cannot do or understand anything.
This, they shouldn't really know anything other than mommy isn't feeling good and may need some quiet time. Other then that, THEY should be their TOP priority. This mention of how "tender" they are being to her is the most ridiculous thing. My toddler, one minute kisses me and the next head butts me. LOL. I don't tell people how sweet and mean he treats me. It's my job to teach him what is appropriate, end of story.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by calliepaige »

I think at this point they are trying to say the word tender as many times as possible in one video just to annoy the shit out of us.

On another note I feel for Ellie and so sad that she is having surgery. I never had to have a D&C but my miscarriage completely broke me. Those emotions are so hard to deal with and everything she said yesterday was spot on. Angry, sad, numb, all in a matter of minutes.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

I haven't watched today's video yet. But I'm not surprised they're going to do a D&C.
Jackson shouldn't be aware of the details. They're crappy parents. They really should just take a YouTube break.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by ApplePie »

HelloSweetie wrote:
gymchick43 wrote:5 min video today, Jared said they are preparing for a D&C tomorrow


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That's interesting, and tells me that Ellie isn't doing well emotionally (which I totally understand). She said a few days ago the plan was to stop the Progesterone and wait a week or two. Then the next day they have Misoprostal and are supposedly miscarrying, and then a D&C tomorrow. That's a lot more intervention in a short period of time than doctors usually like to do. Most patient women are desperate to get it over with, so I imagine Ellie is probably not doing that great. She may also not want to wait two weeks longer to start trying again. I remember that feeling all too well also.

Most people have to take time off work to deal with things like this, it really doesn't sit well with me that they are profiting off this. Jared had to put a vlog out I suppose, but I think he should just take a few days break.
I think her body may not be responding to the meds. I have a friend who recently was in the same situation as Ellie. Your beta levels (pregnancy hormone in your blood) should start decreasing almost immediately on the Misoprostal, but my friend's beta levels weren't. They kept going up. So they had to schedule a D&C a couple of days later. They did another ultrasound right before the D&C just to make sure the sac was still empty and it was. It was very traumatizing for her as it was her first pregnancy.

I can believe Ellie's had at least two beta tests done because my friend had her blood tested every other day.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by littlebaby »

Very interested to see what the vlog will be tomorrow, if there is one at all. Everyone in the comments is saying to take a break. I don't think that'll be the case.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

littlebaby wrote:Very interested to see what the vlog will be tomorrow, if there is one at all. Everyone in the comments is saying to take a break. I don't think that'll be the case.


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They know what tomorrow is going to entail, so if they planned on taking the day off they would have mentioned it today.

I think they should take a break, but won't.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by Shorty02 »

HelloSweetie wrote:
littlebaby wrote:Very interested to see what the vlog will be tomorrow, if there is one at all. Everyone in the comments is saying to take a break. I don't think that'll be the case.


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They know what tomorrow is going to entail, so if they planned on taking the day off they would have mentioned it today.

I think they should take a break, but won't.
They should have taken a break several times over the past year and didn't. They're not going to, because they need the money that this personal tragedy will bring in and because they have some weird pride thing about never skipping a day of vlogging. They live their lives for the vlogs now, there is no more reality.
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E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by littlebaby »

Here's a small blip to talk about besides the miscarriage. We've talk about Calvin's wonky teeth plenty, but lately I've been noticing that Jackson's teeth aren't *that* different. They're definitely a little bit more spaced out, and I think being a year older makes them fit his face more, but it's just something I've noticed recently that no one else has mentioned. They have the same general shape and pattern, in a way. I still think Jackson is the cutest kid ever, I think his teeth just aren't as blatantly noticeable as Calvin's (plus Calvin's neck issues didn't/don't help his face shape in general either). Also, Calvin's teeth seem a lot whiter? Which is probably a good thing in general, but also makes them more noticeable. It makes me wonder how Calvin will look in just a year, but even at Calvin's age, Jackson's teeth were never a topic of conversation. I can't really pinpoint what I'm trying to say but I hope some of you see what I'm saying. Thoughts?

ETA: After looking at some more pictures, Calvin's teeth are just.. super big. And I think his head is a lot smaller. Jackson's teeth were smaller even at Calvin's age, which also helped him.

[img]//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201709 ... d906fd.png[/img]

[img]//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201709 ... f96ae5.png[/img]


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

On the subject of teeth, when I went back to watch the old TTC vlogs of E&J's, I couldn't believe how much nicer Ellie looked before Invisalign. She was beautiful! Now her teeth are distracting and I find it hard to watch her talk for too long.
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