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E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby HelloSweetie » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:49 pm

Nuna wrote:
actuallydear wrote:This thread title is in poor taste, IMO.


Why? I know you've struggled, but so have many of us. I don't see it as meaning that all women who struggle are somehow victims of karma, but I definitely do feel that they faked the first miscarriage, and therefore I do see this as an act of karma.

Have any of the titles been in good taste?


I agree. I've had losses and I'm not offended. Karma is what it is in my eyes. People need to realize that we are talking about E&J specifically and not ANYONE else's journey.

I don't believe there were three miscarriages unless she had one the cycle between the last one and now. It doesn't add up.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby actuallydear » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:53 pm

Nuna wrote:
actuallydear wrote:This thread title is in poor taste, IMO.


Why? I know you've struggled, but so have many of us. I don't see it as meaning that all women who struggle are somehow victims of karma, but I definitely do feel that they faked the first miscarriage, and therefore I do see this as an act of karma.

Have any of the titles been in good taste?

My struggle had nothing to do with the fact I think it's not appropriate right now. Though I would hate for someone else to come across it and think 'did I do something to cause *my* miscarriage.' Because there are so many people who have struggled.

Think of this as a Katie VS Missy situation. It may make others cry while others don't mention it and stay dry as a bone.
shake it up.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby littlebaby » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:54 pm

Also, at the beginning of that caption she said she's lying in bed waiting for medicine to kick in. Could she be talking about misoprostol? It could just be pain meds or something, but the way it's worded makes me think otherwise. Just yesterday (or in today's vlog) she said it's the waiting that's getting to her the most. I don't know recommended procedures for missed miscarriages much. Just thinking out loud I guess. Her wording sounded like it's actively happening now.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby minmouse » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:55 pm

This thread title is not cool. Some may feel this way but not all of us. I think it crosses a line.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby HelloSweetie » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:56 pm

littlebaby wrote:Also, at the beginning of that caption she said she's lying in bed waiting for medicine to kick in. Could she be talking about misoprostol? It could just be pain meds or something, but the way it's worded makes me think otherwise. Just yesterday (or in today's vlog) she said it's the waiting that's getting to her the most. I don't know recommended procedures for missed miscarriages much. Just thinking out loud I guess. Her wording sounded like it's actively happening now.


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Yes. I assumed that's what it was also.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby lmmomSD » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:59 pm

onbreak wrote:"I imagined how sweet Jackson would be to me"
Ugh.


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I know-- that jumped out at me too. And it is NOT the boys' job to "help mommy feel better". That is so wrong.
And where did this second miscarriage come from? I don't believe that the Mother's Day fiasco was a real miscarriage to begin with, and it looks like her family didn't either. But ok, they're going with calling it one. And I do believe this one is real. But how does she come up with three? "We vlogged about 2". No you didn't, not that I can recall. But I haven't seen _every_ vlog, so who knows? Unless I am totally misunderstanding her and she means that this one and the Mother's Day "baby" are the two they vlogged about. We all know how hard it can be to understand her.

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Last edited by lmmomSD on Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby FakingIt_MakingIt » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:00 pm

I don't have a problem with the title. She freaking called IVF couples on Mother's Day to brag.
I feel for her, miscarriage sucks. BUT she was horrid. You get what you give.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby FakingIt_MakingIt » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:01 pm

And when did the third miscarriage happen? I know she considers the clear blue period one but that's still only two. There wasn't a pregnancy before Jackson and there wasn't one in between Jackson and Calvin. She's such a liar.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby BadWolf » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:04 pm

They never mentioned another miscarriage at all in the last vlog. They clearly didn't miscarry before Cal, so it could only have been after. There were no concerns about a miscarriage prior to the first one, and no concerns prior to the latest one. We are supposed to believe there was another miscarriage sometime in between or prior to those though?

Sounds to me like someone is fudging the numbers so they can get a workup by a specialist faster. I was a member of (ironically) the Bump after my losses, and women would quite often lie in order to be seen soon. Its pretty common for clinics to refuse to do a workup until there have been 3 or more.

I know everyone is on the defence right now and wants to protect them, but I really do think they are lying.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby HelloSweetie » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:09 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:And when did the third miscarriage happen? I know she considers the clear blue period one but that's still only two. There wasn't a pregnancy before Jackson and there wasn't one in between Jackson and Calvin. She's such a liar.


She had two losses and yet was so confident about this pregnancy that she took her two children to the viability scan and scheduled a photoshoot for the same day. No fucking way. If it happened prior to the MD announcement, then its EXTRA awful that they called the IVF couple's right away.

And can we talk a little more about her infertility if she gets pregnant every time she ovulates?!
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby Bethypooh51 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:42 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:And when did the third miscarriage happen? I know she considers the clear blue period one but that's still only two. There wasn't a pregnancy before Jackson and there wasn't one in between Jackson and Calvin. She's such a liar.


I think they had an early miss before Jackson. Because I don't believe they had one between Jackson and Calvin because she said in Calvin's pregnancy announcement that she only had one period and that is why they were shocked she got pregnant with Calvin. Then she went on the IUD so they wouldn't get pregnant after Calvin and then she pretty much documented every cycle after she had the IUD out. But before Jackson they had been trying for 5 years and that was before YouTube so that is my guess.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby winniewise » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:45 pm

HelloSweetie wrote:
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:And when did the third miscarriage happen? I know she considers the clear blue period one but that's still only two. There wasn't a pregnancy before Jackson and there wasn't one in between Jackson and Calvin. She's such a liar.


She had two losses and yet was so confident about this pregnancy that she took her two children to the viability scan and scheduled a photoshoot for the same day. No fucking way. If it happened prior to the MD announcement, then its EXTRA awful that they called the IVF couple's right away.

And can we talk a little more about her infertility if she gets pregnant every time she ovulates?!
My bet is she had a heavy period after getting her IUD put it and now looking back after having a miscarriage, she thinks it was heavy enough to be a miscarriage.

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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby marshmallowfluf » Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:40 pm

It shouldn't be very hard to find this mystery miscarriage, look for any time that she looked somewhat of a healthy weight. In those pictures she just posted she looks 4 months pregnant.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby MommaLindsey2 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:48 pm

There is tons of positivity in the comments and ellie or jared is commenting on some of them. A few are saying they love the new vlogging style the past few vlogs and how they are more open. Maybe they will take this to heart. Their views lately are reflecting the quality of vlogging. People don't want to see their fake happy selves every single day barely showing anything interesting,and being secretive. One person even said they stopped watching for a while but will start watching again if the vlogs continue the way they have the past few days. This is a step in the right direction but I still don't think Ellie is a good person. I feel terrible for her though.

And for those saying she "faked" her pregnancy and miscarriage before. I honestly don't think she did. I think she saw a faint line on the test and jumped the gun on sharing the news. Telling the ivf grant winners on mothers day was terribly shitty but I really think in Ellie's mind she was pregnant. I think she had a chemical pregnancy, to some people those are still devastating. I am also wondering when her loss was previously, maybe she got pregnant after calvin/before she got the iud and was somewhat relieved since at that time she was bat shit crazy and struggling with his sleeping issues. I am not sure if she got pregnant before jackson I haven't watched her that long or heard all of her infertility back story.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby boredmamaneedsdrama » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:06 pm

djcbcn wrote:I don't know why you guys think Jared was the one that made the boys go to the appointment. Yeah Ellie said this is why she didn't want to bring them, but if she ultimately didn't want them to go, they would not have been there. We all know Jared does everything he can to keep her happy. The way I took it was she was concerned but in the end decided to do it anyway.

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I'm also not sure why people are assuming this. During that vlog they say they weren't planning on telling Jackson yet and waiting for the ultrasound. Jared says yes because then they could should him a picture, and Ellie says "Or take him". Seems like her idea to me.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby boredmamaneedsdrama » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:10 pm

My guess for the miscarriage is that it was before Jackson which is why it's not vlogged. But honestly this just seems like Ellie exaggerating and wanting attention by being a part of the loss community.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby BadWolf » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:16 pm

Bethypooh51 wrote:
I think they had an early miss before Jackson. Because I don't believe they had one between Jackson and Calvin because she said in Calvin's pregnancy announcement that she only had one period and that is why they were shocked she got pregnant with Calvin. Then she went on the IUD so they wouldn't get pregnant after Calvin and then she pretty much documented every cycle after she had the IUD out. But before Jackson they had been trying for 5 years and that was before YouTube so that is my guess.


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I don't think so. I'm into TTC vlogs again and recently watched most of their old vlogs relating to TTC Jackson and finding out about Calvin. If the had a positive pregnancy test prior to the fertility clinic it never came up and in fact I remember Ellie saying in one of the vlogs that she'd seen a million negative tests and never a positive one.

Then again when she tests for Calvin I remember she mentions that they had tried for 3 years before to get pregnant. If at any point they had a loss, they would have mentioned it. Plus they are so excited about a pregnancy that they decide they have to announce it ASAP, but they had one prior and completely kept it a secret? That makes no sense at all.

Ellie lies. I know people want to give her the benefit of the doubt, but we have seen her lie many times when it benefits her. I think the years of actively trying was grossly exaggerated so insurance would cover the visit to a specialist when Ellie wasn't getting pregnant instantly. I also think the thyroid issues were self-diagnosed (and misunderstood) since Ellie hasn't been seeing an Endocrinologist routinely and has never considered the issues this might play in her fertility issues. I know people feel sorry for them, but they haven't become different people overnight. They were shady before and I think they still are.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby lily_moon » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:18 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:I don't have a problem with the title. She freaking called IVF couples on Mother's Day to brag.
I feel for her, miscarriage sucks. BUT she was horrid. You get what you give.


And I know one dosent have anything to do with the other but also lets all remember how she treated people that waited in line to meet her at those meet and greets. She is not a good person. Period. The title is fine.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby blondeusa » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:24 pm

I know the title specifically references Ellie who's not a great person.

But I don't like the insinuation that karma or anything a mother does makes a miscarriage her fault. Self blame often comes with loss, many of us have experienced that, and I honestly don't feel that this thread title is okay. Karma or not, that is loss shaming.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby canmom2 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:31 pm

Nuna wrote:
actuallydear wrote:This thread title is in poor taste, IMO.


Why? I know you've struggled, but so have many of us. I don't see it as meaning that all women who struggle are somehow victims of karma, but I definitely do feel that they faked the first miscarriage, and therefore I do see this as an act of karma.

Have any of the titles been in good taste?


I agree i think the title is offensive. Maybe the one that made it never had a miscarriage. But when someone we know or watch on youtube does it brings back all the feelings. It makes everything so raw. Look at Katie today remembering hers. Its a human being youu are trying to give life to and failed. I wouldnt want to think its Karma when that happens. I did everything right that I knew about. When you are going through infertility you know as soon as possible you take every step you can to stay pregnant and to think something you did in the past took that dream away. So many others have miscarriages why would you want to add that guilt to us.
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E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby Boredomatitsfinest » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:37 pm

I like the theory that she may have gotten pregnant post Calvin, pre IUD. This is really the only logical time this could have happened, if she's telling the truth.

I highly doubt they miscarried before Jackson. That's back when they were being pretty dang transparent with everything. If they had a story like that to share and gain more views, there's just no way in hell they wouldn't have taken that opportunity.

We all have speculated she got pregnant with Calvin so easily because she was at a healthier weight... I wouldn't be surprised if this happened again after Calvin. In the vlog that Ellie talks about scheduling her IUD removal, she said she got it because she was not ready for another one after Calvin. They could have accidentally gotten pregnant with another, miscarried or had a chemical, and that's what made her realize how unready she was for another. That's right around the time they started becoming more and more secretive and Ellie very clearly was not doing well mentally, so, it would make sense.

But I'm with HS. Please. Let's talk more about her IF. I don't mean to sound insensitive, but it seems to me that it's becoming more and more obvious that it really just comes down to her body fat %.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby HelloSweetie » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:44 pm

I went back and checked the old IF playlist. On Mar 25, 2013 they announce they are going to document their story going forward and promise to be open. They say in the break down of their history that they have never been pregnant. If they had a miscarriage after that point, then they hid it, but I really doubt that given it was TTC that their channel was being built on. If they don't hide it now, they wouldn't have hid it then.

I don't think there was a pregnancy after Cal, but haven't caught up on those vlogs yet to rule it out. So we know when the IUD vlog was?

I think she's adding a third to get that RPL testing sooner and covered by insurance.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby FakingIt_MakingIt » Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:46 pm

I think she's lying. If she had a miscarriage before Jackson they would have been parading that around, it would have only cemented them further in the infertility community.
And if she had a miscarriage after Calvin, before her clear blue iud period she would have known better this supposedly third pregnancy then to be SO sure.
After my first miscarriage I was hyper aware of everything that could, and did, go wrong. Every woman I know has been the same. There is NO way someone who has had two miscarriages, one the previous cycle, is SO confident.
I'm sure she's lying, like they did about the time line while ttc Jackson, so she can get into treatment. What Ellie wants Ellie gets, now.
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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby littlebaby » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:05 pm

I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and say she's not lying about the third miscarriage. It's entirely plausible it happened soon after Calvin. Also, I don't think lying about a miscarriage publicly would go over well with her family, especially because her sisters have experienced multiple miscarriages as well. We can all agree that they're not the most genuine people, especially as Youtubers, but I can't imagine them being okay with a lie about a loss (especially Ruby, who has a detailed video about her five miscarriages). It also wouldn't make any sense if E+J took an extra step and lied about a secret pregnancy to fake a secret miscarriage for their family, just to be able to say she had three miscarriages on a social media post to avoid their criticisms. Ellie is a lot of things, but I can't see this being plausible. Of course E+J could have kept the pregnancy/miscarriage to themselves, but from what we know, that's not how their family works. That being said, if it did happen so soon after Calvin, they may have kept it to themselves longer to freak out and process it alone.

I'm still fuzzy about the Mother's Day business, and honestly haven't even been able to form my own concrete opinion on whether or not I think she was actually pregnant. But this "third" miscarriage, I'll believe. It would make sense as to why she became unreasonably miserable after Calvin and to this day is only happy when she's pregnant. She got her two boys, then had an oops but lost it anyway. Then she probably felt guilty about it, fearing that might have been her last chance (since she still thought she was struggling with infertility.. somehow). Getting pregnant again in May (again, not sure, but in her mind she was..) may have honestly been more about closing the door on her other hidden miscarriage and feeling "worthy" of being able to get pregnant again, than actually getting pregnant again, which is why she was so determined to see that little blue line.

I'm totally just spitballing here, which is all we can do. But that's my take.


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Re: E+J: The Lessons of Karma - Part # 31

Postby lmmomSD » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:06 pm

That's really sucky of she is lying. She's miscarrying, she is in pain, and has the temerity to lie about another miscarriage? I have never had one. That I know of, anyway. But I have plenty of friends who have, and have heard your stories. I can't imagine lying about something like that.
I 100% agree that she's not really very infertile. She hasn't really had any trouble getting pregnant since Jackson. And I think that it's ignorance of how her body works, are how important a healthy weight is. If she really has hypothyroidism, she needs that managed too. I have said it before, but I am continuously flabbergasted by how little she knows about her own body, and her obstinate refusal to learn.


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