E+J - The Phantom Fetus! Part 25

[missbelle]

i havent watched any recent vlogs of e+j's because i dont like them and cant even handle hate watching them but i do watch bonnie and ruby and i thought it was weird that neither of them have vlogged about ellie being pregnant when she announced it. i mightve missed it but i skimmed their social media and nobody posted any congrats or anything :/ the whole thing seemed weird to me.

[whys0seri0us]

So I just played the clip of them on the phone with the nurse a few times and this is exactly what is said...

Nurse: so the blood test shows very low hog levels

Ellie: okay so it is there though

There's a cut

Nurse: it's there but there lower then we would expect for how far along you are

Ellie: yea

Nurse: so they want you to come back in about 48 hours

Ellie: k

Nurse: and they'll just see what's going on

So the nurse does say they are lower then what they would expect for how far along she is. To me this indicates that yes she is pregnant but the levels aren't in line with the timeline. Which would indicate an eventual miscarriage.


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[PhoenixFeathers]

No, you would not get false positives with pregnancy tests with pcos. Only ovulation strips which detect LH (luteninzing hormone) which is the hormone that triggers ovulation. Women actually produce LH all the time, it just surges or spikes prior to ovulation. PCOS and the hormone imbalance that comes along with it make LH strips unreliable.

And personally, despite how much I dislike Ellie and Jared and their scripted lives, I would count this as a chemical pregnancy with the facts presented, which imo is a loss. And a pregnancy​ loss is heartbreaking at any stage. And thats all I'm going to say on the subject and probably need to step away from this forum for a while as well since it seems like people are bent on proving that she didn't have a "legitimate loss" or that its just a chemical pregnancy and she doesn't have the right to hurt over it. As a loss mom myself I just can't deal with anyone being told they shouldn't be upset over a chemical pregnancy or early loss just because we don't Iike the person or they weren't that far along so it shouldn't matter. A loss is a loss.

Sorry for ranting. But this hits close to home. I'll show myself the door.

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[HelloSweetie]

I have PCOS and the way OPKs can't be trusted completely is because our bodies try to ovulate, causing the LH surge (which is what the OPKs detect), and then instead of releasing the egg, a cyst is formed.

Exactly. They can be a useful tool though, if you are also temping to confirm ovulation took place. They can at least offer some hope and optimism if you tend to have irregular cycles and just desperately feel the need to be doing something to try and help things along. Ellie was just grossly misinformed though. GROSSLY.

Playsinrain- The tests Ellie used are known for false positives. No one in the infertility community uses them. No one. Everyone uses the internet cheapies because they can actually test even earlier than First Response can. The test that Ellie used with Calvin, may have caught her hCG extremely early, which then led to the whole confusion about her miscarrying.

Which begs the question.... is there any way she wasn't using cheap tests as well? Were they really just sticking to the CB brand and testing daily? Ellie is fairly obsessive about things, and I can't imagine she was carrying on and looking for symptoms like that, and not testing constantly (like twice a day). If we had seen her use a dollar store test even once, and if it had failed to read anything, this would have been very telling of her levels.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I really think she had a false positive. She went into the doctor's office with a history of a positive test and claiming she was 6 weeks. They ran blood and the numbers were low... too low to confirm if it was an early positive or hCG on the way down. Ellie started bleeding and that, combined with a negative test in the office and very low hCG on the initial test led them to "confirm" Ellie was miscarrying without actually running additional bloodwork or u/s.

Plus one more thing that doesn't make sense is that Ellie must have felt she wasn't going to have an ultrasound that day because she didn't bring Jared, and she brought Jackson who may not sit still while she was being examined. I wonder if she wasn't already spotting when she went to that initial appointment and just didn't have hope that it was a case like Calvin.

[lmmomSD]

But I wonder what very low means. Unless they give us numbers, it's impossible to tell. I wonder if they did a urine HCG in the office.

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[Playsinrain]

Question..... (bc i'm lucky and actually conceived the first month we were trying, but i also have always been clockwork regular with my cycles, i know exactly what my symptoms are when i ovulate and i *knew* how to time properly bc i did some reading before diving into ttcing. I always feel guilty when i explain that we got pregnant very easily, i have a lot of guilt with that bc i have friends in real life and online that have struggled and struggled to get pregnant and you don't know how much i wish i could pass my fertility ease on to every single person i know that has issues.. )

If you have PCOS you aren't supposed to use OPKs bc you release the same hormone as someone who is ovulating all the time, correct? Now i know that the hormone that OPK's detect is not hcg like what a pregnancy test picks up, BUT would a woman with PCOS get false positives with pregnancy tests as well? I guess what i'm asking is if PCOS women have surges in that hormone as well even if they aren't pregnant, resulting in the very faint positive test but not enough to technically be pregnant by bloodwork..

I've honestly learned everything i know about all this stuff ^ here, from what others with knowledge have posted. i've never taken an OPK, and there was no denying the one pregnancy test that i took was positive..

I have PCOS and the way OPKs can't be trusted completely is because our bodies try to ovulate, causing the LH surge (which is what the OPKs detect), and then instead of releasing the egg, a cyst is formed.

It has nothing to do with the presence of hCG.

Ok thank you for the explanation, i knew i was confused and wanted to make sure that the faint positive was not connected with the PCOS.

[whys0seri0us]

I do not like Ellie and Jared. I dislike them the most of all family vloggers. With that being said, I do not think they are lying about this. I think she is genuinely experiencing a loss and I do not blame her one bit for not wanting to be filmed during it.

At some point we have to remember that they are real people, even if their lives seems very scripted on camera.


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[skiingmama1]

The nurse did not say she was pregnant. She said her hCG was lower than they like to see. That doesn't mean she was pregnant.[/quote]
Even men produce HCG. A level above 25 means you're likely pregnant. I don't think Ellie understands that. You don't have to be pregnant to have a positive HCG.
Edited: I see AD already explained this better...

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Right. Anyone who takes a blood test will have HCG present, its the level of it that determines a positive or negative pregnancy result. I highly doubt Ellie knows that though. I would hope that the nurse she spoke to on the phone made her aware of that for future reference. My heart goes out to women who have suffered through miscarriages before, and if that is truly what Ellie is going through thats heartbreaking and I wish her nothing but positivity and healing during this tough time. If she never was pregnant and is simply too proud to acknowledge it to not only her youtube subscribers but more importantly herself, then shame on her for faking such a painful circumstance that many women have sadly suffered through.

[whys0seri0us]

But I wonder what very low means. Unless they give us numbers, it's impossible to tell. I wonder if they did a urine HCG in the office.

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I'm not sure. But her next statement of it being lower then they expect for how far along she is is what convinces me that it was enough to confirm a pregnancy but not enough to confirm it will stick.

I think the hardest part is that that is exactly what they were told with Calvin so of course she was expecting it to turn out fine.


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[HelloSweetie]

But I wonder what very low means. Unless they give us numbers, it's impossible to tell. I wonder if they did a urine HCG in the office.

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I'm not sure. But her next statement of it being lower then they expect for how far along she is is what convinces me that it was enough to confirm a pregnancy but not enough to confirm it will stick.

I think the hardest part is that that is exactly what they were told with Calvin so of course she was expecting it to turn out fine.


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This confusion will keep happening because it's Ellie's lack on knowledge about her own body that is creating it. People tried to warn her not to count on the OPK and she wouldn't listen. People tried to tell her not to put too much weight into symptoms, and she scoffed at that idea. Unless she had a 6 week loss, she was not pregnant when she was insisting she was. It's likely she ovulated almost 2 weeks after that. If her cycles are longer than average, and they appear to be so, then she is going to do this same thing again next month. She will be even more sure of her pregnancy symptoms though because she'll feel she was right this time!

What they need to learn to avoid this is to temp. Confirm ovulation, and then test two weeks from that. Anything else is only going to tell her she is farther along than she is, and her numbers will always appear "off" at first.

[wonderwoman123]

I am new to this forum. I have been watching Ellie & Jared for a year. I truly believed they were being sincere for the most part. Until this "pregnancy." Everything seemed fake from the very start. It seemed very well planned. If you just watch the way Jared is acting as well as his parents you can see that something is different and very off about them. They are not being sincere. They also seem afraid. Like people are going to find out that this wasn't really a pregnancy or maybe that Ellie has some mental health problems. Who knows. All I know is that I am very good at reading people's non verbal communications. I can tell when people are not being genuine. They are not. I would say they should strongly consider coming clean or they are going to lose viewers quickly. They got sucked into the money from clear blue and that is why they did this. If they came clean and were honest I would respect that more than dragging your whole family into this all. Let's see if they make this right. What is everyone's thoughts?

[skiingmama1]

I wonder what the hell they are going to tell Jackson and Calvin now. That there isn't a baby in mommy's tummy anymore? That he or she will take longer than "just a minute" to come out? I feel for them if it was indeed a loss but telling their children that early on was not emotionally healthy for them at all and was a very bad move parenting wise...

[whys0seri0us]

But I wonder what very low means. Unless they give us numbers, it's impossible to tell. I wonder if they did a urine HCG in the office.

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

I'm not sure. But her next statement of it being lower then they expect for how far along she is is what convinces me that it was enough to confirm a pregnancy but not enough to confirm it will stick.

I think the hardest part is that that is exactly what they were told with Calvin so of course she was expecting it to turn out fine.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This confusion will keep happening because it's Ellie's lack on knowledge about her own body that is creating it. People tried to warn her not to count on the OPK and she wouldn't listen. People tried to tell her not to put too much weight into symptoms, and she scoffed at that idea. Unless she had a 6 week loss, she was not pregnant when she was insisting she was. It's likely she ovulated almost 2 weeks after that. If her cycles are longer than average, and they appear to be so, then she is going to do this same thing again next month. She will be even more sure of her pregnancy symptoms though because she'll feel she was right this time!

What they need to learn to avoid this is to temp. Confirm ovulation, and then test two weeks from that. Anything else is only going to tell her she is farther along than she is, and her numbers will always appear "off" at first.

The only thing about that is, most people here don't even believe she has PCOS. So if she doesn't have PCOS then wouldn't the ovulation test have been right?

Idk. We can speculate until we are blue in the face but like someone up there mentioned, with all the facts presented, it seems as though she is having an early miscarriage. I've never experienced a loss of any kind in that department so I'm most certainly not going to judge.


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[HelloSweetie]

I am new to this forum. I have been watching Ellie & Jared for a year. I truly believed they were being sincere for the most part. Until this "pregnancy." Everything seemed fake from the very start. It seemed very well planned. If you just watch the way Jared is acting as well as his parents you can see that something is different and very off about them. They are not being sincere. They also seem afraid. Like people are going to find out that this wasn't really a pregnancy or maybe that Ellie has some mental health problems. Who knows. All I know is that I am very good at reading people's non verbal communications. I can tell when people are not being genuine. They are not. I would say they should strongly consider coming clean or they are going to lose viewers quickly. They got sucked into the money from clear blue and that is why they did this. If they came clean and were honest I would respect that more than dragging your whole family into this all. Let's see if they make this right. What is everyone's thoughts?

Have you lurked here? The whole thing was predicted by members on this board right down to the MD pregnancy reveal. It's a bit crazy.

Interesting you thought they looked scared, because I had the same thought. Jared almost seemed like a husband that was in trouble, more than one that was supporting his wife through a loss. Like a couple that had been arguing and the husband was staying out of his wife's way. I mean, no sign of a Lush basket anywhere? Jared was definitely acting strange, and so were his parents.

[Playsinrain]

The nurse did not say she was pregnant. She said her hCG was lower than they like to see. That doesn't mean she was pregnant.

Even men produce HCG. A level above 25 means you're likely pregnant. I don't think Ellie understands that. You don't have to be pregnant to have a positive HCG.
Edited: I see AD already explained this better...

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk[/quote]


Right. Anyone who takes a blood test will have HCG present, its the level of it that determines a positive or negative pregnancy result. I highly doubt Ellie knows that though. I would hope that the nurse she spoke to on the phone made her aware of that for future reference. My heart goes out to women who have suffered through miscarriages before, and if that is truly what Ellie is going through thats heartbreaking and I wish her nothing but positivity and healing during this tough time. If she never was pregnant and is simply too proud to acknowledge it to not only her youtube subscribers but more importantly herself, then shame on her for faking such a painful circumstance that many women have sadly suffered through.[/quote]

Well she was also told very bluntly not to use OPKs and she didn't listen to that at all, which i think is the reason she's in this situation to begin with, i highly doubt that Ellie would listen and heed any dr's advice that went against what she WANTS to do.

[IceCreamCone]

I didn't watch yesterday's blog and don't want to give them a view. Did the boys spend all day/night at the Mecham's? They were definitely dropping them off in this vlog. If Ellie didn't start bleeding until that morning, it seems a bit strange that they sent the boys off for the whole day and night doesn't it?

Maybe I'm just irritated because I had to continue working and raising my children while awaiting my 48 hr beta results. People weren't bringing me meals like it was already a loss and taking care of my children

[Playsinrain]

I didn't watch yesterday's blog and don't want to give them a view. Did the boys spend all day/night at the Mecham's? They were definitely dropping them off in this vlog. If Ellie didn't start bleeding until that morning, it seems a bit strange that they sent the boys off for the whole day and night doesn't it?

Maybe I'm just irritated because I had to continue working and raising my children while awaiting my 48 hr beta results. People weren't bringing me meals like it was already a loss and taking care of my children

I didn't understand the time line of today's vlog at all and i didn't watch yesterday so... it was confusing bc the boys were there at the start of the vlog, and so were Jared's mom and dad... then he packs up the boys and penny and takes them to his parents house bc ellie was "in a lot of pain".. then he shows putting jackson to bed (still daylight out) before telling us that ellie was bleeding and she had been in bed all day. Someone else commented that it seemed odd that Jared was out of the house all day on a day that most of us would want our spouse to be with them. Seems to me Ellie was so pissed that she was wrong and got her period that she banished everyone from the house, she didn't want Jared, Penny or her boys around at all. I'm completely confused about the timeline, and the fact that they boys and penny were sent away bc of Ellie. Jared is capable of taking care of the boys himself. If she wanted to stay in bed all day then thats completely fine, but she didn't have to send her entire family away..

[wonderwoman123]

HelloSweetie- Yes, I have been reading here recently. I wanted to see if I was the only one who was thinking these things. I did see that you all predicted this very well. It is disturbing to me and I just don't believe they are being sincere anymore. I don't like seeing these you tube families doing whatever they can for money. It's going to come crashing down on them. I am honestly worried for them all. I hope they are saving a lot of the money so they don't lose everything they have. However, from the looks of things they all spend it like crazy. I think there is a lot to be said about Jared's sincerity over Ellie's. She seems like that mean girl that would call you fat and talk behind your back in high school. I just don't trust her. I remember her talking about how Jared didn't want to marry her until she changed how she acted about things. I think that was it. However, she seems to be reverting back to how she was because it doesn't matter anymore. She married him and now he is stuck. I just really hate when people are not being honest and are deceitful.

[HelloSweetie]

^^^^

I had assumed the boys were with his parents or something too because he asked them how they slept almost as though they shouldn't have slept well. It was strange.

[Boredomatitsfinest]

I have a theory...and it doesn't reflect my views or opinion...it's just a theory:

After buying the ClearBlue ovulation tests "because of the smiley face", a late brand deal was made with them to announce the pregnancy on Mother's Day. Ellie could've been testing positive in the mean time using other tests while they were in the process of making the deal, but by the time all was said and done on Mother's Day, it was too late.

I don't know... but as everyone else has said... regardless of if they are being truthful or not now, SOMETHING was up with this whole thing. It was way too scripted and "perfect". And, with all of the brand deals they do.. you know the fact that they used ClearBlue ovulation and pregnancy tests was not a coincidence. Neither was suddenly "getting a positive" on Mother's Day.