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E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby lmmomSD » Tue Sep 12, 2017 1:56 pm

Boredomatitsfinest wrote:The fact that she's vaguely tweeting about looking for a doll is weird in the first place, but a boy doll? Like, aka just a doll dressed in blue? Dolls don't have genitals... lol. The fact that she's looking for a boy doll makes me think that she would want an anatomically correct one, but then why would she be looking at cabbage patch dolls? Haha

Side Note: I was so tempted to put a link to a random sex doll company and say something like, "These are my all time favorite! I've gotten 3 and they last forever. And so realistic!" just to get the strange satisfaction of imagining her clicking on the link and what her reaction would be.
Yes, I am 12 years old.
You win the internet "spit your drink out laughing" contest today! Too bad we wouldn't be able to see her reactions!

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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby workfromhomemom » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:05 pm

Can someone give a synopsis of the video today? I am a little confused by the different accounts of what happened. It sounds like she was definitely pregnant this time.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby phie20 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:05 pm

My eyes got teary seeing Ellie sitting there at the doctors, trying to keep it together for the boys, crying and Jared filming like a freaking camera guy.
I wouldn't want that footage on the internet, it felt like a really intimate moment, Ellies hopes and dreams were breaking apart and you could see it in her face.
I know I'm not the biggest Ellie fan but I have empathy and today's vlog broke my heart a little for them.
Seeing Jared just standing there and filming weirded me out though.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby FakingIt_MakingIt » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:08 pm

Hold up. Im just rewatching and in the first clip where Ellie says "we are having a baby!" Jackson is right there. And that was at 12 DPO, so clearly they didnt try to hide it from the kids AT ALL.

Jackson did not find out on his own, he heard his mother say she was having a baby.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby 3BoysandaLilMiss » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:10 pm

with my daughter I took 4 of the same test (one every 48hrs to see the line get darker), a digital at 5wks
then a ton of internet cheap test after a previous chemical where my lines didn't get darker I wanted to know things where progressing
went in for a dating scan where I could of been anywhere from 5-8wks (not 100% sure of dates) and it showed I was 6wks with a heartbeat

this was real and I feel for them
with my missed miscarriage I went in for a dating u/s at 7wks and saw a sack measuring 5 weeks no baby :(
had an u/s every 7-10 days for 3 weeks just to make sure my dates where not out then finally at 10wks had a D&C as I had no signs of miscarrying on my own
and things had not changed those 3 weeks where hard the not knowing (deep down I knew) but trying to have a little bit of hope things would work out
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby ApplePie » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:10 pm

Regarding the timeline, I think the vlog was a lot of present day and past days mixed together, based in Ellie's hair and the clothes they were all wearing. I went back and looked at Jared's Instagram and the picture he posted of the two of them hugging with Ellie's legs kicked up was the day they tested positive and took video that was in today's vlog based on the clothes they were wearing (her striped shirt and his plaid shirt, posted Aug. 11). I also understood her to mean that they did blood work right after the positive test, got the progesterone pills because her levels were low, and then were scheduled for an ultrasound a month later.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby gopedjane » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:11 pm

gymchick43 wrote:Where I am from it's "frowned upon" to bring your kids to an ultrasound, especially toddlers. I had my 8 week us last week and had no desire to bring my 2 year old.


Where I live it wouldn't even be possible to bring all of the kids in with you. For an ultrasound you have to go to an ultrasound lab where they just do ultrasounds and sometimes they do xrays in the same office. You go in and it's very technical and they don't even show you until they are done, and then if you have someone with you, THEN only they can come in. My husband came for one, and it was a complete waste of time because he was barely in the room for 30 seconds. I found the experience very stressful.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby HelloSweetie » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:15 pm

A progesterone test isn't a pregnancy test. If they didn't eat her hcg and she ovulation, she would absolutely have high progesterone levels (barring any known issues with low P).

Not saying I don't think she was pregnant, but just wanted to clarify because I saw someone use that as proof of a pregnancy.

It isn't likely that her dates where just off either due to the PCOS. From the way the tech was talking to Ellie, it seemed he was making it very clear to her (finally someone recognizes a need to!) that an embryo failed to develop and she had a very early loss. It hadn't just happened.

And I think trying to blame Ellie's behaviour on Jared is absurd. We see Narcissistic tendencies from Ellie both in his presence and not. The issues are definitely all her own and while he arguably enables it, he isn't the cause and I see no evidence of him controlling anything. If this were the case, the boys he wouldn't take a passive stance and let Ellie run the show when it can negatively effect the vlogs or the kids' health.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby natalka81 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:19 pm

There is a lot I side eye about with Ellie and Jared, but I really don't feel like I'm in a position to side eye any of this. It's her body, her cycle, her pregnancy, real or not, viable or not. I guess somehow I don't feel it's my business. The last time, I felt like other people got hurt in the process (announcing on mother's day, being the main thing) but this time I think the only people who are really hurt by this is them. My best friend miscarried yesterday; she's going for the d&c tomorrow. It's heartbreaking, and I don't wish it on anyone. I'm not saying anyone here is wishing this on Ellie and Jared, but I do feel like this time at least, how they tell the story, whether the timeline is exact, how many tests they actually did, etc. is kind of beside the point. I think it's clear they are hurting. And what it does highlight for me is the questionable decision to record one's life for all to see, and the vulnerability (yes, self-inflicted, I know) that goes with that decision. I guess it's not cut and dry for me. I absolutely hated the care bear vlog and thought this family couldn't get much worse, but then today, I could see their humanity and honestly I felt a bit humbled. That doesn't mean that I won't be supremely annoyed at the next lush bomb video extravaganza or the way Ellie treats the server at McDonalds, but just that I am reminded maybe that there is more than one side to someone. Just my thoughts...
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby canmom2 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:21 pm

That was a sad video today. Like her or not i can feel for her. My son was 6 years in the making. I can feel for her. When I got pregnant I did all those test too. I took a new test every day for weeks and then every week until I was 16 weeks even thought I heard a heart beat.Jackson is a tough little boy he was so sweet on the swing. He will understand why mom and dad are sad some days. He will be sad too. ELLIe saying she felt bad for Jackson he might be taking this a little harder than the last one.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby canmom2 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:30 pm

Playsinrain wrote:Maybe i'm showing my ignorance (and my fertile privilege) but is it "normal" for someone to take THAT many tests?? I mean i only ever took one, then went to the dr and had blood work done. I guess with the low progesterone issue i can see taking tests to make sure i was still pregnant, but then again wouldn't you still be getting positive tests bc the hormones are still in your body? Even after losing a pregnancy you still can have positive tests for quite some time afterward right? Someone else said they could see her getting obsessed with testing now and i can already see it in that video, there had to be 20-30 tests there and she was only 8 weeks pregnant? idk, like i said i have been blessed and never had issues getting pregnant (other than an early miscarriage in my teens) so this is coming from someone who never had a reason to test that many times.. but it just seemed a little... much? I dont want to come off as insensitive.


I did for someone who tried for 6 years yes. I took them every day for weeks and then every week until i was 16 weeks. And had a blood test at 5 weeks.Even though I could hear the heartbeat. I also took took my temp for a month after. It is like you try so hard and cant believe it when you finally are.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby canmom2 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:35 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
callie73 wrote:I don't know how many are actually familiar with mormonism, but mormon women's self worth is tied up into how many kids they can have, they believe that they are supposed to give a physical body to as many spirit children as possible. in mormon heaven "spirit children" wait for a body. that's the truth. The women are told their place is in the home to raise children. They are viewed almost as 2nd class with no other value outside the home. so having a miscarriage is a huge deal to mormons. there is no official mormon doctorine about miscarriages.

someone also mentioned ellie and her depression. Depression is very widespread within mormonism. They are pushed to be perfect. The level of perfection cannot be obtained, but they still spend their lives trying. The are given callings that they must do even if they are so busy as it is. sometimes they are given more callings on top of callings. They must live their lives as perfect so they can get their temple recommend. They want to be worthy to enter the temple, so they try to live their lives as appearing perfect.

I really feel for ellie and Jared and their families.



I am a mormon actually. I am not viewed as 2nd class, nor do I have children. A miscarriage is a huge deal to most, regardless of their religion, Ive had multiple myself and have never felt any worse about it because Im a mormon, if anything my knowledge of Christ and the after life is a HUGE comfort during my miscarriages. Mormon women have value outside the home, many run successful business, myself included.
Also, depression isnt any more common in mormonism then it is umong the rest of the world. We are not pushed to be perfect, infact we KNOW we arent perfect, and that we cant be perfect.
We are asked if we would like a calling, we are given the option to say no.
We do try to live worthy of the temple, but that does not equal living perfect.

Good for you for setting the record straight. Some people are so prejudiced.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby LittleRus » Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:12 pm

I have been pregnant 3x. 2 kids and 1 early m/c in between. With the early loss, I took tests that never got darker. I probably took 20 of them. With the pregnancy after that, I took SO.MANY.TESTS. I do not judge the amount she took at all because I was right there with her.

I keep thinking of this and what I can't wrap my head around is their reaction to this pregnancy vs the last one (if you can even call it that). When Ellie was saying "I'm pregnant!" in the beginning of today's vlog she seemed SO excited. The last one...was just bizarre to watch. Neither seemed particularly excited and I find it interesting that she took so many brands this time yet last time, it was a couple faint (as in, I surely didn't see a link) ClearBlue tests that are notorious for being inaccurate. I do think Ellie really wanted to be pregnant then but I just don't think she was.

I wish we saw more vlogs like today. While my heart broke with them today, it was nice to see that raw-ness and realness about them.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby lmmomSD » Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:18 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
callie73 wrote:I don't know how many are actually familiar with mormonism, but mormon women's self worth is tied up into how many kids they can have, they believe that they are supposed to give a physical body to as many spirit children as possible. in mormon heaven "spirit children" wait for a body. that's the truth. The women are told their place is in the home to raise children. They are viewed almost as 2nd class with no other value outside the home. so having a miscarriage is a huge deal to mormons. there is no official mormon doctorine about miscarriages.

someone also mentioned ellie and her depression. Depression is very widespread within mormonism. They are pushed to be perfect. The level of perfection cannot be obtained, but they still spend their lives trying. The are given callings that they must do even if they are so busy as it is. sometimes they are given more callings on top of callings. They must live their lives as perfect so they can get their temple recommend. They want to be worthy to enter the temple, so they try to live their lives as appearing perfect.

I really feel for ellie and Jared and their families.



I am a mormon actually. I am not viewed as 2nd class, nor do I have children. A miscarriage is a huge deal to most, regardless of their religion, Ive had multiple myself and have never felt any worse about it because Im a mormon, if anything my knowledge of Christ and the after life is a HUGE comfort during my miscarriages. Mormon women have value outside the home, many run successful business, myself included.
Also, depression isnt any more common in mormonism then it is umong the rest of the world. We are not pushed to be perfect, infact we KNOW we arent perfect, and that we cant be perfect.
We are asked if we would like a calling, we are given the option to say no.
We do try to live worthy of the temple, but that does not equal living perfect.
I don't mean this in a disrespectful way-- my very best friend in high school was Mormon, and I spent a lot of time with her and her friends. I found what you say to be mostly true. BUT-- we always hear that Utah Mormons are more hard core. My best friend went to BYU for one year after growing up in the SF Bay Area, and couldn't stand it. She said it was like Barbie and Ken University. Colette Butler has talked about bringing souls down to earth. She even said her son Daxton and nephew Winston "remembered each other from heaven" when Winston was born. And I have also read about Utah Mormons having a high rate of depression and opiate addiction due to the pressure. Ellie's sister Ruby continued to try to have babies despite miscarriages and being broke. So, I am asking, could it be that Mormons who aren't in the Utah/Idaho bubble are less inclined to be this way, and that if they're in Utah, the pressure is higher to be the perfect mother?
I am very sorry this happened. I loathe these two, but don't wish that kind of pain on anyone. I do wish they hadn't told Jackson, or taken him to a viability scan. He's so smart and sweet. I hate that he had to witness that. I wish I thought Ellie would get some help. But I know she won't. "Just smile!"

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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby jbg1515 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:42 pm

Pency wrote:...also, more evidence of the last "miscarriage" probably not being real is the sheer amount of different kinds of tests she took this time. Last time it was just that ONE blue dye test that is notorious for being misread.
EXACTLY!! It was definitely just her starting her period last time whether she truly believed it was a miscarriage or not

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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby winniewise » Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:46 pm

Oof. Today's vlog was a heartbreaking for real. Seeing the clips of happy pregnant Ellie were so sad. Knowing what was coming at the ultrasound appointment, I just kept thinking "no no no"!

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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby staceybrax » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:02 pm

I feel really bad for them, I wouldn't wish a miscarriage on anyone. But I wish Ellie would take some time to work on herself before falling pregnant again. Her extremely low weight would have to play some factor in difficulty falling pregnant or keeping a pregnancy, she needs work on her issues with food and make sure her body is healthy and nourished before falling pregnant, it's not enough to start eating after you're already pregnant. She needs to work on why she is only happy when she's pregnant, it's not normal for a grown woman to only be happy when she's the centre of the world. It's not normal to push your older children aside when you fall pregnant like they're nothing, she needs to learn how to balance it all out.


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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby amyfalafal » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:05 pm

Well, that was interesting. I watched them for the first time in weeks.

I do believe she was pregnant this time. I wonder if the doctor trusted the dates she gave based on her own schedule or blood test dates? Last time was a trainwreck.

I hope she educates, or is educated on how her body works for a successful pregnancy. I think she was lucky with Jackson and Cal. And if she knows she needs extra meds, then get it right away... there is no excuse to not getting it. She has the time, and money to get whatever she needs to assist in a healthy pregnancy.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby FakingIt_MakingIt » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:09 pm

lmmomSD wrote:
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
callie73 wrote:I don't know how many are actually familiar with mormonism, but mormon women's self worth is tied up into how many kids they can have, they believe that they are supposed to give a physical body to as many spirit children as possible. in mormon heaven "spirit children" wait for a body. that's the truth. The women are told their place is in the home to raise children. They are viewed almost as 2nd class with no other value outside the home. so having a miscarriage is a huge deal to mormons. there is no official mormon doctorine about miscarriages.

someone also mentioned ellie and her depression. Depression is very widespread within mormonism. They are pushed to be perfect. The level of perfection cannot be obtained, but they still spend their lives trying. The are given callings that they must do even if they are so busy as it is. sometimes they are given more callings on top of callings. They must live their lives as perfect so they can get their temple recommend. They want to be worthy to enter the temple, so they try to live their lives as appearing perfect.

I really feel for ellie and Jared and their families.



I am a mormon actually. I am not viewed as 2nd class, nor do I have children. A miscarriage is a huge deal to most, regardless of their religion, Ive had multiple myself and have never felt any worse about it because Im a mormon, if anything my knowledge of Christ and the after life is a HUGE comfort during my miscarriages. Mormon women have value outside the home, many run successful business, myself included.
Also, depression isnt any more common in mormonism then it is umong the rest of the world. We are not pushed to be perfect, infact we KNOW we arent perfect, and that we cant be perfect.
We are asked if we would like a calling, we are given the option to say no.
We do try to live worthy of the temple, but that does not equal living perfect.
I don't mean this in a disrespectful way-- my very best friend in high school was Mormon, and I spent a lot of time with her and her friends. I found what you say to be mostly true. BUT-- we always hear that Utah Mormons are more hard core. My best friend went to BYU for one year after growing up in the SF Bay Area, and couldn't stand it. She said it was like Barbie and Ken University. Colette Butler has talked about bringing souls down to earth. She even said her son Daxton and nephew Winston "remembered each other from heaven" when Winston was born. And I have also read about Utah Mormons having a high rate of depression and opiate addiction due to the pressure. Ellie's sister Ruby continued to try to have babies despite miscarriages and being broke. So, I am asking, could it be that Mormons who aren't in the Utah/Idaho bubble are less inclined to be this way, and that if they're in Utah, the pressure is higher to be the perfect mother?
I am very sorry this happened. I loathe these two, but don't wish that kind of pain on anyone. I do wish they hadn't told Jackson, or taken him to a viability scan. He's so smart and sweet. I hate that he had to witness that. I wish I thought Ellie would get some help. But I know she won't. "Just smile!"

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I don't live in Utah, but I live in the Canadian Utah. Seriously. Over 90% of our population is lds.
I am sure it varies regionally but if Utah Mormons do feel that then it really has nothing to do with the Mormon religion but the people.
Yes, we do believe we are spirits before we come down to earth, it's not impossible that we could know each other.
Ruby continuing to have children while having miscarriages has nothing to do with the religion but what Ruby felt called to do. I don't have children, I have had multiple losses. We aren't trying anymore.
There is no rule in Mormonism that you must have x amount of children. Or that you have to be happy all the time. We do believe in finding the blessings in every situation, but that doesn't mean we dont have crappy things going on. And what mother doesn't want to try her best to be the perfect mother? That has nothing to do with religion.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby PenelopeG » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:17 pm

Ok I'm putting my 2 cents in only because I happen to be pregnant and on the same time line as Ellie.
I ovulated on July 30. I waited to test til August 15, which worked out on making it easy, it was 15DPO. I have still kept my mouth shut about it because I have had a miscarriage before. Because I had a miscarriage before my OB did blood work right away and an ultra sound at 4w5d. They saw a sac and the lining looked good but it was way too early. She also checked my progesterone to make sure the levels where ok.
Now weeks later I am 8w2d which I don't know why she said she was 8w4d yesterday?? She added days for sure.
I've had spotting issues and because I have a fear of having another miscarriage I have not told anybody. My kids have no idea, my family doesn't know, and my work doesn't know. Just me and my husband. This is why you have to be careful and should wait for 12weeks or later. Yes you can tell people for support but I truly believe on not putting that sadness on anyone else. But that's just me.

Anyway I believed you guys when everyone knew she was pregnant because she was obviously happier. But when I saw her in person at the care bear event.... I changed my mind. 1. Her boobs where small still 2. She was standing in 4 inch platforms for 2 hours straight and 3. When they got to the event Calvin was asleep and she was holding him from the time I saw her get out of an elevator all the way down halfway through the mall. That's at least 8 stores to walk. I, an 8 week pregnant person, could not have done that with out passing out. Yes I know every women is different and she doesn't have to be just like me but after seeing her that day, I just felt like she wasn't.

I feel sad for them because I've been there. But that's why I chose to be so careful now that so far everything has been ok. I'm still choosing til 12 weeks to say anything and I've already had 2 good ultrasounds. I hope they learn. And this also makes me question the first "miscarriage" because anybody who has gone through it, are so scared and paranoid when it happens again. But not happy as a clam Ellie! Why? Because she knew it wasn't really a MC last time


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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby callie73 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:30 pm

canmom2 wrote:
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
callie73 wrote:I don't know how many are actually familiar with mormonism, but mormon women's self worth is tied up into how many kids they can have, they believe that they are supposed to give a physical body to as many spirit children as possible. in mormon heaven "spirit children" wait for a body. that's the truth. The women are told their place is in the home to raise children. They are viewed almost as 2nd class with no other value outside the home. so having a miscarriage is a huge deal to mormons. there is no official mormon doctorine about miscarriages.

someone also mentioned ellie and her depression. Depression is very widespread within mormonism. They are pushed to be perfect. The level of perfection cannot be obtained, but they still spend their lives trying. The are given callings that they must do even if they are so busy as it is. sometimes they are given more callings on top of callings. They must live their lives as perfect so they can get their temple recommend. They want to be worthy to enter the temple, so they try to live their lives as appearing perfect.

I really feel for ellie and Jared and their families.



I am a mormon actually. I am not viewed as 2nd class, nor do I have children. A miscarriage is a huge deal to most, regardless of their religion, Ive had multiple myself and have never felt any worse about it because Im a mormon, if anything my knowledge of Christ and the after life is a HUGE comfort during my miscarriages. Mormon women have value outside the home, many run successful business, myself included.
Also, depression isnt any more common in mormonism then it is umong the rest of the world. We are not pushed to be perfect, infact we KNOW we arent perfect, and that we cant be perfect.
We are asked if we would like a calling, we are given the option to say no.
We do try to live worthy of the temple, but that does not equal living perfect.

Good for you for setting the record straight. Some people are so prejudiced.


It's not prejudiced. I was just stating how my former-ward treats people and how many of them believe, maybe the person is treated differently at their ward and is taught better.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby alym0326 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:32 pm

One thing I will say is I'm impressed Ellie was proactive and asked to be put on progesterone. I didn't expect her to be proactive about that stuff.


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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby actuallydear » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:34 pm

This is so sad.

Also, if she was on progesterone supplements her body would be prevented from miscarrying naturally. Once she stopped the progesterone her body will release the pregnancy (hopefully).

The pregnancy stopped developing but they did not know that. They had a missed miscarriage at 8 weeks. They thought they were pregnant for an entire month. Is that any different to somebody who found out they were pregnant the same time, went for their first ultrasound and found an 8 week pregnancy that had appeared to lose its heartbeat a day prior? Nope. All the same. I've been there and it sucks.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby HelloSweetie » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:35 pm

alym0326 wrote:One thing I will say is I'm impressed Ellie was proactive and asked to be put on progesterone. I didn't expect her to be proactive about that stuff.


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Except that's not proactive, it's naive. It won't prevent a miscarriage on most cases. Not all women need that. It will only prevent a miscarriage if you have issues with your Progesterone falling.

She doesn't do the things she should do for the conditions she does have, and insists on doing things that will help for conditions there is zero evidence she has.
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Re: E+J: 4 Bites of Tender Steak. PART 30

Postby lmmomSD » Tue Sep 12, 2017 4:36 pm

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
lmmomSD wrote:
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:[quote="callie73"]I don't know how many are actually familiar with mormonism, but mormon women's self worth is tied up into how many kids they can have, they believe that they are supposed to give a physical body to as many spirit children as possible. in mormon heaven "spirit children" wait for a body. that's the truth. The women are told their place is in the home to raise children. They are viewed almost as 2nd class with no other value outside the home. so having a miscarriage is a huge deal to mormons. there is no official mormon doctorine about miscarriages.

someone also mentioned ellie and her depression. Depression is very widespread within mormonism. They are pushed to be perfect. The level of perfection cannot be obtained, but they still spend their lives trying. The are given callings that they must do even if they are so busy as it is. sometimes they are given more callings on top of callings. They must live their lives as perfect so they can get their temple recommend. They want to be worthy to enter the temple, so they try to live their lives as appearing perfect.

I really feel for ellie and Jared and their families.



I am a mormon actually. I am not viewed as 2nd class, nor do I have children. A miscarriage is a huge deal to most, regardless of their religion, Ive had multiple myself and have never felt any worse about it because Im a mormon, if anything my knowledge of Christ and the after life is a HUGE comfort during my miscarriages. Mormon women have value outside the home, many run successful business, myself included.
Also, depression isnt any more common in mormonism then it is umong the rest of the world. We are not pushed to be perfect, infact we KNOW we arent perfect, and that we cant be perfect.
We are asked if we would like a calling, we are given the option to say no.
We do try to live worthy of the temple, but that does not equal living perfect.
I don't mean this in a disrespectful way-- my very best friend in high school was Mormon, and I spent a lot of time with her and her friends. I found what you say to be mostly true. BUT-- we always hear that Utah Mormons are more hard core. My best friend went to BYU for one year after growing up in the SF Bay Area, and couldn't stand it. She said it was like Barbie and Ken University. Colette Butler has talked about bringing souls down to earth. She even said her son Daxton and nephew Winston "remembered each other from heaven" when Winston was born. And I have also read about Utah Mormons having a high rate of depression and opiate addiction due to the pressure. Ellie's sister Ruby continued to try to have babies despite miscarriages and being broke. So, I am asking, could it be that Mormons who aren't in the Utah/Idaho bubble are less inclined to be this way, and that if they're in Utah, the pressure is higher to be the perfect mother?
I am very sorry this happened. I loathe these two, but don't wish that kind of pain on anyone. I do wish they hadn't told Jackson, or taken him to a viability scan. He's so smart and sweet. I hate that he had to witness that. I wish I thought Ellie would get some help. But I know she won't. "Just smile!"

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I don't live in Utah, but I live in the Canadian Utah. Seriously. Over 90% of our population is lds.
I am sure it varies regionally but if Utah Mormons do feel that then it really has nothing to do with the Mormon religion but the people.
Yes, we do believe we are spirits before we come down to earth, it's not impossible that we could know each other.
Ruby continuing to have children while having miscarriages has nothing to do with the religion but what Ruby felt called to do. I don't have children, I have had multiple losses. We aren't trying anymore.
There is no rule in Mormonism that you must have x amount of children. Or that you have to be happy all the time. We do believe in finding the blessings in every situation, but that doesn't mean we dont have crappy things going on. And what mother doesn't want to try her best to be the perfect mother? That has nothing to do with religion.[/quote]Thanks. I really hope that I didn't sound disrespectful. I know there's a lot of ignorance about your faith here and I didn't want to add to it. Thanks for responding so nicely.

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