Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by janemom1 »

I'd love to hear what their church members ACTUALLY think of all the Griffiths and their families...are they brainwashed into thinking they are #familygoals, which makes me sick when I see minions say that, or think how stupid they are etc
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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by Exutahmormoninsights »

janemom1 wrote:I'd love to hear what their church members ACTUALLY think of all the Griffiths and their families...are they brainwashed into thinking they are #familygoals, which makes me sick when I see minions say that, or think how stupid they are etc
I grew up in a small town in Utah to very active church going parents. I would say that the Griffiths are a very common bunch of idiots. The church doesn't out right oppose women from going to school but the culture does not encourage it at all. Many young mormon women have the priority if becoming married before actually finding themselves. I've seen many sad relationships because people get married very young and very early in the relationship. So the way in which the Griffith girls raise their families is common practice and I'm sure many church members don't blink an eye at it. It's also very competitive and passive aggressive, fellow church goers won't necessarily praise you for the way you live. This is my experience anyway. I am only a year younger than Ellie,I have many high school friends who are blogging or blogging but it's all bullshit. They put up this front of a perfect family to get attention whilst in real life they are constantly on there phones and using the TV as a babysitter so they can do it. All of this to say, sadly, this family is nothing special in Utah mormon standards
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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by xoxocharlie »

Grandma Griffith wrote: "Lacy" instead of Lucy. She even said Lacy out loud haha.
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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

How does the Griffith’s religion encourage their dysfunction? This topic is too HOT and OT for some of the boards, so I’m bringing it up here as a place to discuss because I think it’s completely relevant. I also think it’s larger than just the Bonnie board where it blew up. It applies to all the Griffiths (except maybe Beau?) in a large way.

This also doesn’t need to necessarily mean the church is the sole blame for the dysfunction, but I think things like “not having contention with family members” definitely plays a role in making an abuser’s job easier by shutting your opinion up and making you tow the line and excuse issues you maybe shouldn’t. This would definitely normalize things that shouldn’t be normal, like yelling, throwing things when angry, saying things you shouldn’t, etc.

It’s an interesting discussion imo anyway.




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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

HelloSweetie wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:48 am How does the Griffith’s religion encourage their dysfunction? This topic is too HOT and OT for some of the boards, so I’m bringing it up here as a place to discuss because I think it’s completely relevant. I also think it’s larger than just the Bonnie board where it blew up. It applies to all the Griffiths (except maybe Beau?) in a large way.

This also doesn’t need to necessarily mean the church is the sole blame for the dysfunction, but I think things like “not having contention with family members” definitely plays a role in making an abuser’s job easier by shutting your opinion up and making you tow the line and excuse issues you maybe shouldn’t. This would definitely normalize things that shouldn’t be normal, like yelling, throwing things when angry, saying things you shouldn’t, etc.

It’s an interesting discussion imo anyway.




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I honestly don't believe that their religion encourages much of how they behave. Most of what they say and do is directly against church teachings.
Not having contention with family doesn't mean to sweep things under the rug or ignore issues. We are encouraged to love, understand, and communicate with our families. The church in NO way encourages or normalizes yelling, throwing things or saying mean things.
From what we have seen of Beau, which granted isn't much, he seems to be following more along the lines of what the church teaches then the rest of his siblings. He isn't coveting what they have, he isn't involved in drama....
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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
HelloSweetie wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:48 am How does the Griffith’s religion encourage their dysfunction? This topic is too HOT and OT for some of the boards, so I’m bringing it up here as a place to discuss because I think it’s completely relevant. I also think it’s larger than just the Bonnie board where it blew up. It applies to all the Griffiths (except maybe Beau?) in a large way.

This also doesn’t need to necessarily mean the church is the sole blame for the dysfunction, but I think things like “not having contention with family members” definitely plays a role in making an abuser’s job easier by shutting your opinion up and making you tow the line and excuse issues you maybe shouldn’t. This would definitely normalize things that shouldn’t be normal, like yelling, throwing things when angry, saying things you shouldn’t, etc.

It’s an interesting discussion imo anyway.




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I honestly don't believe that their religion encourages much of how they behave. Most of what they say and do is directly against church teachings.
Not having contention with family doesn't mean to sweep things under the rug or ignore issues. We are encouraged to love, understand, and communicate with our families. The church in NO way encourages or normalizes yelling, throwing things or saying mean things.
From what we have seen of Beau, which granted isn't much, he seems to be following more along the lines of what the church teaches then the rest of his siblings. He isn't coveting what they have, he isn't involved in drama....

But you have that opinion being within the church. You only know how YOUR FAMILY chose to handle that scripture. If your entire family had a “we don’t argue” philosophy, then it imprints that upon you as well or you’ll be the black sheep. Even families that aren’t religious can create this dynamic. But having religious “rules” you can point to definitely makes the argument stronger.

Another example of this is that most people outside of the church would view asking a minor about their sexual experiences as shocking and inappropriate. Within the church this is justified and can be explained as making sense because it’s within the rules. This one “rule” makes pedophilia so much easier. It doesn’t mean that all priests are pedophiles, but it has an arguable impact on a child’s vulnerability.

Trying very hard to have a discussion here. Do not take it personally.


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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

And you have an opinion from not being in the church. So that point is pretty moot.

It’s not just how my family has interpreted a particular scripture through, it’s how that scripture is taught at church. We have never, not once, been taught to behave the way the Griffiths do.
I have not ever heard in one talk, lesson, or class that the way the Griffith family operates is ok.

Asking if someone is following the law of chastity in a worthiness interview is not the same as encouraging pedophiles. It just isn’t.
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Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by HelloSweetie »

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:And you have an opinion from not being in the church. So that point is pretty moot.

It’s not just how my family has interpreted a particular scripture through, it’s how that scripture is taught at church. We have never, not once, been taught to behave the way the Griffiths do.
I have not ever heard in one talk, lesson, or class that the way the Griffith family operates is ok.

Asking if someone is following the law of chastity in a worthiness interview is not the same as encouraging pedophiles. It just isn’t.

I think you are deliberately missing my point.

Also, if you’re just going to dismiss any discussion as being because I’m “not in the church” and can’t possibly understand, maybe you should let the discussion happen here (where you don’t have to participate and read how wrong we are) for any others that similarly might not be in the church and might have a opinion?

And no grown man needs to ask a 13 year old girl if she’s touched herself. I don’t need to be in the church and a victim of it to recognize those that have said it hurt them. Worthiness interviews absolutely cross a line and were so important to the church that they excommunicated the man who dared to stand up and request change. It’s an unnecessary practice, that has the possibility to hurt and shame children. The church making so “ok” absolutely can help predators groom children.



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Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

Oh my hell. It’s the same flipping thing. If you’re going to dismiss my opinion by saying I’m in the church then what’s the point? It’s clear you don’t want to have a discussion, and by the way nobody else has chimed in but us yet, you just want to “prove” your option is the most right.

I’ll say it again, a worthiness interview doesn’t create a pedophile.

When you’re ready to have a real discussion about the church vs the Griffith behaviours and listen to an opinion different then your own (and an opinion from someone who actually knows what the church teaches because they go to said church) without dismissing it as a biased commenter then let me know. Until then, have a good day.
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Unread post by HelloSweetie »

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:Oh my hell. It’s the same flipping thing. If you’re going to dismiss my opinion by saying I’m in the church then what’s the point? It’s clear you don’t want to have a discussion, and by the way nobody else has chimed in but us yet, you just want to “prove” your option is the most right.

I’ll say it again, a worthiness interview doesn’t create a pedophile.

When you’re ready to have a real discussion about the church vs the Griffith behaviours and listen to an opinion different then your own (and an opinion from someone who actually knows what the church teaches because they go to said church) without dismissing it as a biased commenter then let me know. Until then, have a good day.
I didn’t want the LDS opinion though. I want to have the discussion I stated about how it CAN possibly be a contributor the Griffiths. I didn’t ask how it couldn’t.

I’ll be honest... I’m not looking to have my mind changed about the church. I’m also. It trying to change your mind. I moved the discussion here because you were clearly offended by it on the Bonnie board. We won’t agree, but I know there are others that do and it’s still a discussion worth having. I’ve seen things normalized by religion (not just LDS) that I could never agree with. I think this normalization an absolutely play a part in helping families be dysfunctional. There are so many Griffiths, and they are so similar. It would be ridiculous to say their religion hasn’t in some way been a factor.


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Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

HelloSweetie wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:44 am
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:Oh my hell. It’s the same flipping thing. If you’re going to dismiss my opinion by saying I’m in the church then what’s the point? It’s clear you don’t want to have a discussion, and by the way nobody else has chimed in but us yet, you just want to “prove” your option is the most right.

I’ll say it again, a worthiness interview doesn’t create a pedophile.

When you’re ready to have a real discussion about the church vs the Griffith behaviours and listen to an opinion different then your own (and an opinion from someone who actually knows what the church teaches because they go to said church) without dismissing it as a biased commenter then let me know. Until then, have a good day.
I didn’t want the LDS opinion though. I want to have the discussion I stated about how it CAN possibly be a contributor the Griffiths. I didn’t ask how it couldn’t.

I’ll be honest... I’m not looking to have my mind changed about the church. I’m also. It trying to change your mind. I moved the discussion here because you were clearly offended by it on the Bonnie board. We won’t agree, but I know there are others that do and it’s still a discussion worth having. I’ve seen things normalized by religion (not just LDS) that I could never agree with. I think this normalization an absolutely play a part in helping families be dysfunctional. There are so many Griffiths, and they are so similar. It would be ridiculous to say their religion hasn’t in some way been a factor.


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Ahh so you don’t really want to have a discussion with people who don’t see your opinion. You just want to discuss with like minded folks. That seems to be the problem you have in every thread you post in.
News flash, discussing how it CAN effect them also means discussing how is doesn’t effect them.

And you stating it over and over doesn’t make it true. I’m not offended in the slightest. I’m just not letting you railroad over my opinions because you feel yours are the most valid.
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Unread post by natalka81 »

A "worthiness interview"??? Look, I try really hard not to be judgmental of others' beliefs but when a religious institution can tell you if you're worthy enough to join them, and bases its definition of "worthiness" on very private and personal matters that should, in my opinion, only be between you and God (or just you if you don't believe in a god), and if it's generally accepted that LGBTQ people would have trouble getting a temple recommend, I have a big problem with it. I am expressing my opinion only and everyone is allowed to practice what they wish, but human rights play a role in this that I just can't overlook.
And to bring the conversation back to the Griffiths, I think that the LDS church has a huge impact on the way those children are being brought up that isn't entirely positive. Is it entirely negative? No. But teaching your kids that some people aren't worthy of joining their faith is just wrong to me. I feel sad that all the Griffiths children, who are bright, curious, and energetic young people, are being raised this way.
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natalka81 wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:16 pm A "worthiness interview"??? Look, I try really hard not to be judgmental of others' beliefs but when a religious institution can tell you if you're worthy enough to join them, and bases its definition of "worthiness" on very private and personal matters that should, in my opinion, only be between you and God (or just you if you don't believe in a god), and if it's generally accepted that LGBTQ people would have trouble getting a temple recommend, I have a big problem with it. I am expressing my opinion only and everyone is allowed to practice what they wish, but human rights play a role in this that I just can't overlook.
And to bring the conversation back to the Griffiths, I think that the LDS church has a huge impact on the way those children are being brought up that isn't entirely positive. Is it entirely negative? No. But teaching your kids that some people aren't worthy of joining their faith is just wrong to me. I feel sad that all the Griffiths children, who are bright, curious, and energetic young people, are being raised this way.
A worthiness interview isn't about joining the faith, its about holding a temple recommend. There's a difference there that I feel needs clarifying.

A lot of members don't agree with the LGBTQ stance actually, but the church has absolutely drawn a hard line in the sand around it.

The LDS church does believe that all can join though, and yes there are requirements. But they do believe that all can make the decision to join if they wish, that's what missionaries, baptisms for the dead and temple ordinances by proxy are all about.
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Unread post by HelloSweetie »

I’m not going to a KKK rally just to hear what they have to say even if they do start doing some good things too. This is the same principle behind why I won’t listen to the justification for worthiness interviews, or anti LGBT rhetoric.

Thank you Natalka for at least seeing what I was trying to say.




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So everyone has the right to choose to join the LDS church, but some people, based on their sexual orientation and other things (I am assuming there may be other things) do not have the right to have a temple recommend, meaning that they can't really be full participants in the religion, even if they choose to do so? I admit I am not an expert on this, but it still seems rather exclusionary to me. And I'm not targeting this at you specifically (although I am sure it must feel a little like that and I'm sorry) but I'm just having a really hard time accepting that it's a positive position to have when raising children in the modern world. Those of us who belong to some faith group likely don't endorse everything it stands for, so I'm not saying ALL Mormons hate LGBTQ people or anything like that, but again, it is my personal opinion that kids should be brought up to know that everyone is equal before God.
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natalka81 wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:28 pm So everyone has the right to choose to join the LDS church, but some people, based on their sexual orientation and other things (I am assuming there may be other things) do not have the right to have a temple recommend, meaning that they can't really be full participants in the religion, even if they choose to do so? I admit I am not an expert on this, but it still seems rather exclusionary to me. And I'm not targeting this at you specifically (although I am sure it must feel a little like that and I'm sorry) but I'm just having a really hard time accepting that it's a positive position to have when raising children in the modern world. Those of us who belong to some faith group likely don't endorse everything it stands for, so I'm not saying ALL Mormons hate LGBTQ people or anything like that, but again, it is my personal opinion that kids should be brought up to know that everyone is equal before God.
I don't feel like youre targeting me at all. I'll do my best to answer but Im not a master LDS teacher, nor do I know all things either.

Yes, everyone has the right to join, and yes some don't qualify to hold a recommend to go into the temple. There are many things which would exclude you from entering the temple (sexual preference included). But being worth for the temple or not doesn't mean that God loves you more then someone else. My holding a recommend in NO WAY means that God loves me more then he loves you, or anyone who doesn't hold a recommend. God doesn't work like that. And the church doesn't teach that He does.
The church teaches that we should always be striving and working to be our best selves. For some that is being a recommend holder, for others that's not part of their path. And that's absolutely fine.
If the Griffith kids are being brought up to think theyre more loved by God because of their faith then that is on the Griffiths. That is not at all what we are taught at church. We are actually taught the opposite, nearly every sunday school lessons includes loving everyone because that is how God loves them. Whether theyre straight, gay, rich, poor, a different race, anything. We are taught to love everyone and be kind to everyone because that is what God would do.
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Unread post by HelloSweetie »

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
natalka81 wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:28 pm So everyone has the right to choose to join the LDS church, but some people, based on their sexual orientation and other things (I am assuming there may be other things) do not have the right to have a temple recommend, meaning that they can't really be full participants in the religion, even if they choose to do so? I admit I am not an expert on this, but it still seems rather exclusionary to me. And I'm not targeting this at you specifically (although I am sure it must feel a little like that and I'm sorry) but I'm just having a really hard time accepting that it's a positive position to have when raising children in the modern world. Those of us who belong to some faith group likely don't endorse everything it stands for, so I'm not saying ALL Mormons hate LGBTQ people or anything like that, but again, it is my personal opinion that kids should be brought up to know that everyone is equal before God.
I don't feel like youre targeting me at all. I'll do my best to answer but Im not a master LDS teacher, nor do I know all things either.

Yes, everyone has the right to join, and yes some don't qualify to hold a recommend to go into the temple. There are many things which would exclude you from entering the temple (sexual preference included). But being worth for the temple or not doesn't mean that God loves you more then someone else. My holding a recommend in NO WAY means that God loves me more then he loves you, or anyone who doesn't hold a recommend. God doesn't work like that. And the church doesn't teach that He does.
The church teaches that we should always be striving and working to be our best selves. For some that is being a recommend holder, for others that's not part of their path. And that's absolutely fine.
If the Griffith kids are being brought up to think theyre more loved by God because of their faith then that is on the Griffiths. That is not at all what we are taught at church. We are actually taught the opposite, nearly every sunday school lessons includes loving everyone because that is how God loves them. Whether theyre straight, gay, rich, poor, a different race, anything. We are taught to love everyone and be kind to everyone because that is what God would do.

The comment that started this whole discussion was about how Bonnie probably doesn’t even hold a recommend anymore. It definitely was meant to imply she wasn’t as good as those with a recommend.

If the church excludes anyone based on a factor they have no control over, they can say they aren’t against it, but they absolutely are.


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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by FakingIt_MakingIt »

HelloSweetie wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:41 pm
FakingIt_MakingIt wrote:
natalka81 wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:28 pm So everyone has the right to choose to join the LDS church, but some people, based on their sexual orientation and other things (I am assuming there may be other things) do not have the right to have a temple recommend, meaning that they can't really be full participants in the religion, even if they choose to do so? I admit I am not an expert on this, but it still seems rather exclusionary to me. And I'm not targeting this at you specifically (although I am sure it must feel a little like that and I'm sorry) but I'm just having a really hard time accepting that it's a positive position to have when raising children in the modern world. Those of us who belong to some faith group likely don't endorse everything it stands for, so I'm not saying ALL Mormons hate LGBTQ people or anything like that, but again, it is my personal opinion that kids should be brought up to know that everyone is equal before God.
I don't feel like youre targeting me at all. I'll do my best to answer but Im not a master LDS teacher, nor do I know all things either.

Yes, everyone has the right to join, and yes some don't qualify to hold a recommend to go into the temple. There are many things which would exclude you from entering the temple (sexual preference included). But being worth for the temple or not doesn't mean that God loves you more then someone else. My holding a recommend in NO WAY means that God loves me more then he loves you, or anyone who doesn't hold a recommend. God doesn't work like that. And the church doesn't teach that He does.
The church teaches that we should always be striving and working to be our best selves. For some that is being a recommend holder, for others that's not part of their path. And that's absolutely fine.
If the Griffith kids are being brought up to think theyre more loved by God because of their faith then that is on the Griffiths. That is not at all what we are taught at church. We are actually taught the opposite, nearly every sunday school lessons includes loving everyone because that is how God loves them. Whether theyre straight, gay, rich, poor, a different race, anything. We are taught to love everyone and be kind to everyone because that is what God would do.

The comment that started this whole discussion was about how Bonnie probably doesn’t even hold a recommend anymore. It definitely was meant to imply she wasn’t as good as those with a recommend.

If the church excludes anyone based on a factor they have no control over, they can say they aren’t against it, but they absolutely are.


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No, I don't think my comment about Bonnie not holding a recommend implied at all that she wasn't as good as those who do hold a recommend. If you took it that way then that's on you and your interpretation of a simple sentence. But just because that's how you interpreted it doesn't make it true.

When I said that Bonnie probably doesn't hold a recommend I mean that she probably doesn't hold a recommend. She doesn't appear to be going to church all that often, she doesn't talk about having a calling, she doesn't act like she cares about anything other then herself so maintaining her recommend doesn't seem high on her list. That does not mean to say that she isn't as good as the next person because she doesn't have a recommend. Never, not once did I say she wasn't as good as someone who has a recommend.

This is the perfect example of you reading into a comment and having it all wrong. You could have avoided an entire blow up by asking for clarification instead of assuming you know all.

Once again for you, I never once said that Bonnie was wasn't as good as a recommend holder because I speculated she may not be a current recommend holder. Nobody else did either as far as I can recall.
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Re: Comparing The Griffiths (Post at your own risk!)

Unread post by natalka81 »

FakingIt_MakingIt wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:34 pm
natalka81 wrote: Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:28 pm So everyone has the right to choose to join the LDS church, but some people, based on their sexual orientation and other things (I am assuming there may be other things) do not have the right to have a temple recommend, meaning that they can't really be full participants in the religion, even if they choose to do so? I admit I am not an expert on this, but it still seems rather exclusionary to me. And I'm not targeting this at you specifically (although I am sure it must feel a little like that and I'm sorry) but I'm just having a really hard time accepting that it's a positive position to have when raising children in the modern world. Those of us who belong to some faith group likely don't endorse everything it stands for, so I'm not saying ALL Mormons hate LGBTQ people or anything like that, but again, it is my personal opinion that kids should be brought up to know that everyone is equal before God.
I don't feel like youre targeting me at all. I'll do my best to answer but Im not a master LDS teacher, nor do I know all things either.

Yes, everyone has the right to join, and yes some don't qualify to hold a recommend to go into the temple. There are many things which would exclude you from entering the temple (sexual preference included). But being worth for the temple or not doesn't mean that God loves you more then someone else. My holding a recommend in NO WAY means that God loves me more then he loves you, or anyone who doesn't hold a recommend. God doesn't work like that. And the church doesn't teach that He does.
The church teaches that we should always be striving and working to be our best selves. For some that is being a recommend holder, for others that's not part of their path. And that's absolutely fine.
If the Griffith kids are being brought up to think theyre more loved by God because of their faith then that is on the Griffiths. That is not at all what we are taught at church. We are actually taught the opposite, nearly every sunday school lessons includes loving everyone because that is how God loves them. Whether theyre straight, gay, rich, poor, a different race, anything. We are taught to love everyone and be kind to everyone because that is what God would do.
But it isn't "absolutely fine", in my opinion, if someone wants temple to part of their path, but are told by the institution that it isn't possible. I really do appreciate you sharing this information, though- there's a lot about the LDS church that I don't know! I think I've said everything I can on this topic.
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Unread post by HelloSweetie »

^^^^^

Your opinions have been noted.

I still think the church is a large contributing factor.

The Griffiths live in a bubble. The church isn’t exactly encouraging progressiveness, so each generation stays within the bubble for the most part. Hence families that seem to lack empathy and knowledge of the world around them like the Griffiths. Not saying this is the same if ALL LDS wards, but I have definitely heard Utah is a different culture.


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